HW77 Venom Project
Printed From: Kiwi Airgunners
Category: Technical
Forum Name: Pauly's Technical Area
Forum Description: Technical information, Modifications and DIY projects are all in here
URL: www.kiwiairgunners.co.nz/forum_posts.asp?TID=653
Printed Date: 23 Nov 2024 at 10:06am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 10.14 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: HW77 Venom Project
Posted By: J-S
Subject: HW77 Venom Project
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2022 at 12:47pm
Newest project in - a pickup from trademe with very little info and bad pics. I could see its a Weihrauch underlever so for the price it was worth taking a punt.
Got it home for a check and it has a brass extra setback trigger, and a steel muzzle weight. Adding pics onto a couple of facebook groups the consensus is its a Venom HW77 or at least had venom parts added. serial number says its around 1987, venom was started early 80s so the timing is right.
Shooting is very smooth, no spring noise on cocking, no twang when firing, not like a standard Weihrauch.. so Im looking forward to stripping it down and seeing whats inside.
Power is 11.5 footpound, and shot variance of about 19fps - not bad but room for improvement. May have a hardened seal, spring may be weak.
The bluing is worn and there are a few rust spots, so currently investigating getting it re-blued to a high gloss finish.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Replies:
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2022 at 6:24pm
Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2022 at 2:33pm
I had a free evening so got it stripped to its bare bones. Spring was broken, seal was hard and had a crack forming in the face. It was 11.5fpe like that so guessing it’s a full power model.
Metal is off to be reblued, so looking forward to what he can do with it.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2022 at 10:44pm
Little update; I got the action reblued, and it’s much better. As there was some corrosion it could’t go gloss black, as there would have had to have been too much metal removed to bright polish. But it looks much better than it did!
Also added a touch of gold on the lettering, using Tamiya enamel model paint.. a few coats and gently wiping off remaining paint left a nice gold inlay.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2022 at 11:25pm
that lettering came out crisp. Blueing is going to pop out against that stock. Its going to be good to see a picture of it reassembled at end. You got a spring and seal lined up?
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 7:28am
Yeah stocks on its way from UK, hopefully a good piece of walnut. I’m still thinking about the internals, I have a new HW97 spring, but being venom it would have been a bit more tuned - everything has been polished internally and the guides are custom and springs are usually short and strong vs Hw standard which are a bit longer and thinner. I can get a V-Mach kit which is next evolution in the Venom heritage once Venom stopped, but it’s pricey..
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 7:45am
what was up with the stock in the pic above. Its got a awsome worn in look to it.(in my view) I guess its a love or money thing. Building it for love and great gun,go the whole hog on the expense. Building it to sell, settle for well built, firing great.
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 8:51am
The stock isn’t bad, and I’ll keep it so I can put it back on if need be. As I was doing the bluing which now looks near new I figured I would give it a fresh look and more custom. I don’t plan to sell it any time soon, as a likely wouldn’t get my money back LOL, so just trying to make a nice showpiece that shoots well. I’m still tossing up whether to go full power, or tame it down a bit to 12 foot pound
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 11:09am
I see the rear block is the same as the 97 and screws off. I wonder if Weihrauch use this for the higher power guns? The 95 has the rear block that swivels and locates into the main action.
I don't really know, but have always wondered the reason behind that design difference.
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 11:56am
Pauly5 wrote:
I see the rear block is the same as the 97 and screws off. I wonder if Weihrauch use this for the higher power guns? The 95 has the rear block that swivels and locates into the main action.
I don't really know, but have always wondered the reason behind that design difference. |
good question - it may just be the older models; the 35 / 55 / 80 all have the screw off jobby and the 95 has the plug type.. May be a case that it was the on all their models and the ones that have carried on as is (change means less interchangable parts between old stock, new stock etc of the same model), while newer ones have 30 / 57 / 95 have the newer way of doing things...
'insert shrug icon here'
Most tutorials I see insert the spring and rear guide using the block and awkwardly trying to screw it in under tension etc, but Ron mentioned he has a jig to push the spring past the screw hole, put a pin punch in the screw hole, screw in the cap with no tention, remove pin then snug it all up.
If I go V-mach there is far less preload with the shorter strong spring - more like the TX200 (clever poms)
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 12:09pm
Interesting. What stock are you getting for it?
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 1:32pm
CS500 from cutom stocks UK. Should be here on Wednesday..
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 1:34pm
First new nail polish, now a new dress. Oh behave!
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2022 at 3:35pm
Pauly5 wrote:
First new nail polish, now a new dress. Oh behave! |
Then a good ol' lube up.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: dvlnme
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2022 at 3:38pm
after new nail polish and dress its bit of a worry jono what exactly you are up to with that lube mate ha ha, cheers mike
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 10:25am
More bits ready; Custom Stock CS500 in select grade walnut, rosewood grip cap and ordered as plain as I didnt like their laser checkering..
"select grade" is basically hand selecting a piece rather than lucky dip / next in line. It doesnt guarantee special figuring but simply the best piece they have from the lot.
The blanks are cut from whole slabs of walnut rather than ordered as blanks.
Still, this side has some nice colour going on
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 11:17am
That is a very nice piece of wood. I particulary like how the grain and colour on the forend is flows with length of wood then tightens into the tighter grain of knot wood of where the grip and cheek piece are. The new blued reciever and barrel is going to make it pop out. Gonna look awsome.
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 11:26am
kruzaroad wrote:
That is a very nice piece of wood.
I particulary like how the grain and colour on the forend is flows with length of wood then tightens into the tighter grain of knot wood of where the grip and cheek piece are. The new blued reciever and barrel is going to make it pop out. Gonna look awsome. |
The other side is a little plainer but I do like the grain in the fore end on this side and it has some nice red-brown colouring too. And besides, this is the side my face sees when shooting!
Just gotta sort the internals and get it all together.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: mercs
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 5:58pm
Great to see so many interesting things happening on the forum.
This could be a "looker".
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Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 8:58pm
Wow wow wow that stock looks amazing 🤩
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2022 at 10:38pm
Very nice Jono. I like the plain look. Do you get to hand burnish some massage oil into it?
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 15 Sep 2022 at 9:19am
Pauly5 wrote:
Very nice Jono. I like the plain look. Do you get to hand burnish some massage oil into it? |
No Pauly, just some light fondling for now..
The finish isnt too bad, and they finish with danish oil - Id need to see whats compatible if i want to refinish or smooth it, but ill likely leave it for now
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2022 at 5:43pm
Done! Topped off with an older Simmons ProAir air rifle scope for retro look.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: xyon
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2022 at 5:47pm
Good stuff. Looking great now
------------- --- My favourites springer - Diana 52 PCP - FX Wildcat III
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Posted By: Myson
Date Posted: 22 Nov 2022 at 6:08am
Wow! That's beautiful J-S! A cracker looking beast! Well done!
------------- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq7jVyBfFqE" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq7jVyBfFqE Air Arms S510 US .22 Air Arms S410 .22 Weihrauch HW97KT .177 Weihrauch HW95 .177
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Posted By: mercs
Date Posted: 22 Nov 2022 at 5:38pm
Functionality and good looks.I like the scope and close proximity to the chamber. Nicely done sir.
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Posted By: Stuart
Date Posted: 22 Nov 2022 at 8:44pm
Very nice job, I brought a HW77 .22 in Blackpool in UK in 1984 and it came with me to NZ in 85 regrettably sold it late 90s a great gun I should have kept. You have a good one there.
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Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:10pm
That's a beautiful rifle, well done
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:11pm
Cheers guys!
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2023 at 11:34am
Well after installing the V-Mach kit, it’s struggling to make 10fpe, so I got talking with Paul Short in UK after enquiring if he could confirm the trigger was one of his early super set backs (which it was), and after initial likely diagnosis that the comp tube is leaking I was sick led into the rabbit hole of tuning and ended up with this on my doorstep; a Paul Short stage 4 titanium kit. Includes the piston and comp tube, both glided, spring and custom guides, seal, all pre-lubed very sparingly ready to drip in. It’s a lovely bit of kit and currently in process of selling a kidney to recoup costs but will be nice to have the rifle up and running better than new and in the heritage in which it started being customised. It still has a venom muzzle but it’s very much a Paul Short HW77
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2023 at 3:39pm
Internal bling.
very nice. Are both piston and cylinder Titanium? It'll be good to hear how it shoots?
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Posted By: Myson
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2023 at 4:31pm
Stunning looking rifle Jono!!! Excellent job!
Is that Paul Short stage 4 titanium kit an alien artifact?!!!
That looks "out of this world"! You'll be shooting beyond the speed of light with that kit fitted! It'll probably sort out Vampires too!!
I guess that was a wee bit expensive? But Top Shelf eh?! Great project....
------------- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq7jVyBfFqE" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq7jVyBfFqE Air Arms S510 US .22 Air Arms S410 .22 Weihrauch HW97KT .177 Weihrauch HW95 .177
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2023 at 4:33pm
Pauly5 wrote:
Internal bling.
very nice. Are both piston and cylinder Titanium? It'll be good to hear how it shoots? |
The jeweled part is the visible section, the rest is less bling.. But i got a cool sticker too!
I imagine the piston is titanium, the comp tube doesnt need to be..
It was chronoed at 11.6fpe before leaving UK so will be interesting to see where its at in the old 77
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 15 Apr 2023 at 12:00pm
J-S always has the sexiest rifles
Looks an absolute stunner. Love the groove for thumbs up shooting
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2023 at 11:36am
Myson wrote:
Stunning looking rifle Jono!!! Excellent job!
Is that Paul Short stage 4 titanium kit an alien artifact?!!!
That looks "out of this world"! You'll be shooting beyond the speed of light with that kit fitted! It'll probably sort out Vampires too!!
I guess that was a wee bit expensive? But Top Shelf eh?! Great project....
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Thanks, it looks great installed with the jeweled finish in the breech area.
Yes, it was expensive compared to some kits, about the price opf buying a cometa fusion...
But when you consider that the piston is titanium, and its the complete internals including the compression tube with breech seal, piston, piston seal, piston liner, spring, spring guides and spare washers, the finishing etc, and the labour to make it all, prelubricate it so its a 'drop in' kit, and test its power before getting out the door, im ok with the price.. oh, and a sticker too..
Its installed now ands shooting 11.2ft lb, and its nice and smooth. Not super fast - 740fps-ish, but nice to shoot.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2023 at 11:45am
Billbobnz wrote:
J-S always has the sexiest rifles
Looks an absolute stunner. Love the groove for thumbs up shooting |
Thanks, but im just putting together other folks bits so cant claim any of their kudos, but its coming together nicely.
The CS stock is nice, the thumb up groove is really comfortable. They've been making stocks for a lot of the UK brands in the 80s and 90s (Theoben, Venom, Air Arms, etc), and their current offerings are still in that style which i like.
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2023 at 2:08pm
Well, she’s all together. Looking good, shooting smooth at 11.2fpe / 740fps. Went to go get it sighted in roughly before taking to the range and the scopes out of elevation!! Bugger. Now just to get some adjustable mounts to try and get it nicely on paper!
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: Pauly5
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2023 at 2:55pm
What a lovely piece there Jono. I must say your lawn looks good too.
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2023 at 4:47pm
Pauly5 wrote:
What a lovely piece there Jono. I must say your lawn looks good too. |
Thanks.
The lawn - Thats called ‘saturation’ and ‘vibrancy’ in the phone photo editing settings..
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: JasonEdward
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2024 at 10:59pm
Any updates?
What a very beautiful rifle you have made. Just lovely.
Does it group up well?
One question i need to ask you who know - for best accuracy, is it a good idea to keep power down to the Brits under 12 requirement or can springer shoot as straight with more power?
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Posted By: J-S
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2024 at 9:32am
JasonEdward wrote:
Any updates?
What a very beautiful rifle you have made. Just lovely.
Does it group up well?
One question i need to ask you who know - for best accuracy, is it a good idea to keep power down to the Brits under 12 requirement or can springer shoot as straight with more power? |
Cheers; At the moment its in the safe, only a small job to do which is smooth out the cocking slot for a screw to ride in that keeps the piston centred; its a bit tight and gritty but other than that it shoots well.
Power vs accuracy is often a matter of pellet choice and getting used to how the rifle likes to be shot.
considering the HW77, full power is only around 15-16fpe so no magnum anyway so its not a huge difference to the uk power. Ive had the most changes in my TX200, which summarised below:
(the TX200 mkiii is really made for export / high power, so the brits are less keen on this one compared to the older mkii which was 12fpe)
- Factory standard full power - 15ish fpe; snappy cycle with a bit of thump, stacked pellets with JSB exact Heavy 10.34gr.
- added spring guides from TBT - made rifle smoother but didnt change power or accuracy
- reduced power for target shooting with TBT short sproke extension; this uses the full power spring for a quick snappy cycle with less felt recoil, and reduced air volume which basically replicates the older mkii. Best pellet now JSB exact Express (hates the heavies now with reduced power) and around 11fpe
- went to a skirtless piston from UK, recoil is reduced further, spring is still a strong spring so a quick cycle - very efficient. similar power to above but slightly lower, now it likes QYS Streamlined pellets which is unfortunate because they arent readily available here.. JSB Express are second in line.
so a matter of getting used to the rifle and how it shoots, how it likes to be held, and pellet testing when you change power. magnum power will be harder to control, think 22fpe HW80, Diana magnums etc, but if they have a good barrel and predictable trigger they have the potential to be just as accurate as low power if you do your part - low power is just easier to achieve the accuracy / consistency..
------------- https://www.instagram.com/js_airguns/" rel="nofollow - J S Airguns Air Arms TX200('s) Theoben Sirocco HW77 FWB 300s Webley Patriot One or two others...
Current projects: Too many..
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Posted By: RangerPete
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2024 at 6:08pm
Agree with J-S, power and accuracy are not necessarily tied together. Powerful springers can be very accurate (one of the members here has a big Diana 56 pushing over 20FPE thats a tack driver), and lower power springers can shoot horribly.... Its all about searching for that perfect combination of rifle, pellet, and shooter.
Of corse it does help if you start your search holding a good quality rifle in your hands
------------- Walk quietly, but carry a big stick.
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Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2024 at 8:37pm
The sig was a 20fpe and as accurate as. But it's fpe at target, which mid range muzzle energy, tends to be softer on recoil and carries power out 80m/100m. Or so I have found.
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