Best caliber for goats?
Printed From: Kiwi Airgunners
Category: Hunting
Forum Name: Small bore powder burners
Forum Description: all your small bore hunting stuff in here
URL: www.kiwiairgunners.co.nz/forum_posts.asp?TID=1125
Printed Date: 23 Nov 2024 at 5:03am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 10.14 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Best caliber for goats?
Posted By: RangerPete
Subject: Best caliber for goats?
Date Posted: 14 Nov 2024 at 3:12pm
What do you recon is a good caliber for goats, and why do u think that caliber is suitable?
Any experiances to share?
-------------
Walk quietly, but carry a big stick.
|
Replies:
Posted By: nunga
Date Posted: 14 Nov 2024 at 5:40pm
|
Thats a loaded question. Need a bit more information on that before we could advise.
What distance are you talking? I have taken out goats with my .25 springer out to 20 meters.
If you are looking at 100+ meters I would say 223 min
-------------
2nd place HP springer - WFTF World Championships 2014
|
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 14 Nov 2024 at 9:03pm
Environment makes difference too.
Rock environment or steep faces open up potential for ricochet, bush is going to need something that can push through small vegetation like twigs and leaves with out deflection. Paddocks depends on distance and back drop.
Goats get taken with everything from small cal, to things like 303.
Back in my younger days 303 was used a lot more due availably.
Shoties, 17hmr
Better question might be what fpe at target is needed to drop a goat.
Also how well can place a shot,are you shooting for meat or pest control. All these things affect the type of ammo and gun you use.
|
Posted By: RangerPete
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2024 at 4:02pm
It would be pest control in mixed terrain, open, bush, steep hills.
Probably longish shots, I would guess anything from 30 out to 150.
I would agree, anything from 223 up could do the job.
Wanted to hear if anyone has a pet caliber, and why.
I'm not so sure about 17hmr. Never used one my self, but from what I understand about them that little 17grain bullet is very frangabile and designed to break apart on impact. Will cause a devastating wound channel, but only 8 or 10cm deep, blow a rat in half, destroy a rabbits vitals, but i dont know if it has the penetration needed for an adult goat?
-------------
Walk quietly, but carry a big stick.
|
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2024 at 4:09pm
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2024 at 4:21pm
https://youtu.be/wrx_A6LCARQ?si=fKs_lOYaM1r1mgld
You decide
https://youtu.be/zKekxNPMG0k?si=F3TmumbAwy9aBxd9
|
Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2024 at 9:50pm
|
.223 or .243 or what about .22 hornet?
|
Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2024 at 9:51pm
|
And with a decent suppressor, bipod or on a tripod
|
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2024 at 4:18pm
Here's a 22lr 22mag 17hmr test
Also hollow and fmj for each
https://youtu.be/bmqnWfUKViE?si=qIgFJysQ2WGO5loq
Diffenr test
https://youtu.be/5kZfWfafFs0?si=DD8q4rwHng0RyiL7
As long as you can place them well killer rounds.
All these rounds are seriously underestimated in my view.
All fit into rabbiting as a pesting round a lot better then the larger rounds.
That's it from me.
|
Posted By: RangerPete
Date Posted: 19 Nov 2024 at 5:35pm
I agree with you, all are underrated, and as always, shot placement is always vital.
I’ve been watching quite a few of these hunting and comparison videos on you tube about the 17HMR, trying to educate myself without actually being able to shoot one..
There is no doubt that it is a fierce little round. The videos of it penetrating steel plates are very impressive.
The video of the guy culling impala is all close range stuff, although he seems to have grass in front of his scope in every shot???
In Africa “management culling” is usually done from a vehicle because you can get much closer than on foot.
The description says it well when he says wind, twigs and blades of grass are the undoing of that little 20gr bullet.
As I type this I’m looking at a 13.4gr .177 Spyda slug sitting on my desk in front of me, and I'm thinking a 17gr or 20gr .177 is not going to be that much bigger than that tiny little piece of lead…!
The guy who shot the pig was also close, 19 yards. He shot it in the neck, below the spine which is why it dropped from the initial shock, but got up and left as it recovered.
But I do believe if he had shot it in the brain it would have dropped DRT, like the impala.
I've also been looking into what .17HMR ammo is available these days.
Up to now I thought .17HMR ammo was only available as varmint rounds like the very hot V-Max. The soft nose and FMJ's are new to me.
One thing that irritates me is how everyone talks about how those little bullets explode and that’s why they are so deadly...
What crap.
Bullets don’t explode. Dynamite explodes. C4 explodes, hand-grenades explode.
Bullets don’t explode.
Depending on the bullets design, and its intended use, a bullet will either not change shape at all (solids/FMJ), partly deform, i.e. mushroom (softs/soft nose/hollow point), or fragment into little pieces (frangible).
When the .17HMR was first released 20 odd years ago it was intended as a varmint round, for use on varmints and small game such as squirrels, ground squirrels, rabbits, hares, ground hogs etc. which are all hare sized or smaller.
The bullets were designed to be frangible, meaning they are made with a very light construction and are intended to fragment into tiny pieces and come to a stop within a few centimetres of impact. Which is why they create massive but shallow trauma. They were never designed to give penetration. If you are shooting a squirrel or rabbit size animal, all you need is massive but shallow trauma, and you've already penetrated more than half way through the animal. Usually DRT.
One of the youtube videos I watched the guy said after much testing he decided he would rather use a .22mag (40grain bullet) over a .17HMR for racoons, because the .17HMR just doesn’t penetrate enough to get to the vitals on a racoon.
The addition of soft nose and FMJ bullets in .17HMR ammo changes the applications of what you can do with a .17HMR.
However most people still seem to be using them for racoon / coyote size animals and smaller.
Could you cull a goat (impala or pig) with a 20yard head shot from a .17HMR and the correctly constructed (soft nose or FMJ) bullet? Absolutely, I have no doubt the penetration would be achieved and it would drop like a stone.
Should we be shooting goats at 100 or 150 yards with a .17HMR? I’m not sold on that yet.
My gut feel is still that a 17 or 20gr projectile (soft or solid, defiantly not the frangible ones) is still too small and light for a goat size animal. A goats humorous, scapula or even a rib is going to severely impact the penetration of a 20gr projectile, but I’ll reserve my judgement until I’ve had the chance to play with one.
I would love to have one with some of the frangible V-max rounds for some long range bunnies though!
-------------
Walk quietly, but carry a big stick.
|
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 19 Nov 2024 at 5:55pm
At end of day it's what your comfortable with.
I'm not sure about up here but down south island Wanaka i think had shooting range that let you fire all manner of cal. Wasn't cheap but if there's something like that up these ways, you may be to get on a range and test fire a few differnt cal and see if any are more preferable to what you want.
|
Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2024 at 1:15pm
Just a thought, had a friend who used to (and probably still does) shoot a 22-250 for goats.
Was looking at this video last night
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=viatCbGtdZ8
|
Posted By: kruzaroad
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2024 at 2:24pm
And you do taxidermy bb!
I find the irony of that and that video hellishly amusing.
🤣🤣
|
Posted By: Billbobnz
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2024 at 2:28pm
|
Hahaha yep, but these are already stuffed at poit of impact hahaha
|
Posted By: RangerPete
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2024 at 11:25pm
Billbob, I actually have a 22-250.
Can’t even compare the cost of ammo for a 22-250 to a .17HMR or a .22Mag 😳
I’ve been considering how cheaply I could reload for, and I think I can get it down to about $1.20 a round, so if I’m reloading it’s not much more than the rimfires.
A 223rem is another caliber I think would be great for goats, but if I’ve already got a 22-250 it’s hard to justify getting a 223 😂.
Only problem is my 22-250 has a beautiful, and heavy, laminated stock and a heavy bull barrel, not ideal for trapsing around the hills with.
-------------
Walk quietly, but carry a big stick.
|
|